SOPID-CLIPY conflicts

Hoppie

The inbound streams from the north-west into SOPID (for BNN to Heathrow) and CLIPY (for BOMBO to BWY) come close enough to cause conflicts as both streams are being descended to FL150.
If there are two fixes anyway, why not place them a bit further apart so that under normal circumstances the standing agreements just work?

In that same general area, climbers out of Birmingham and descenders into WELIN to HON also cause conflicts that are only solvable by picking up these airplanes into the BNN sector while they are not supposed to contact BNN at all. This does not so much feel like a sim problem but like an airspace problem. What do I miss?

Hoppie

FewCloudy

I can’t speak for airspace design but in my experience you are almost always on headings descending towards SOPIT in that area (and well into the BNN sector too).

CloggyUk

As FewCloudy says, Headings are the way to sort it out!

Not sure what you mean regarding the BB outbounds and traffic via Hon?
Traffic via Hemel into BB/NX needs to be 220 lvl Hemel. Then Welin sector has to descent is 190 to keep it inside WELIN airspace, but keep it 170 or above to keep it out of BNN sector.

In general, a lot of traffic travels through sectors that it doesn't speak to. You just have to miss it if it goes through your sector.

cheers, C

Hoppie

CloggyUk

Late response -- sorry.
I agree that WELIN should keep traffic out of (above) BNN but it does not. Very often I have inbounds from the west to BOMBO at FL150 as they should be and then somebody bricks through from above on the way to FL090 somewhere WELIN or HON. The standing agreement is "FL090 20 nm before HON" but they go for FL090 asap rsn, apparently.

I think I should watch videos of real ATC BNN to get a hang of what happens there. I cannot figure out whether the airspace is designed in a way that I don't get, or the simulator messes up occasionally.

Hoppie

FewCloudy

While we’re here… if an aircraft is on a heading and then cleared to FL150 level by SOPIT does that imply level “abeam” SOPIT or is the waypoint ignored and the aircraft descends regardless because it isn’t tracking towards SOPIT?

CloggyUk

In real world terms you would say
150 lvl SOPIT if on own nav or 150 lvl abeam SOPIT if on a heading.
In the Sim, you would just have to use 150 lvl SOPIT and it would do either as far as I have experienced.

Cheers, C

CloggyUk

Hoppie Hiya. I haven’t really noticed a lot of traffic infringing into BNN sector. I have just checked, but the Standing agreement is 90 at Hon. If you have 90 Hon-20 then I am not surprised that they might infringe BNN. Just to check you have one the the latest updates. If memory serves me, it used to be 90 Hon-20.

Cheers, C